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ECA Stack: Info, FAQ's, Cycle Guide

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IanWatson
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Posts: 408
Locker Roommates
ECA Stack: Info, FAQ's, Cycle Guide « : June 24, 2012, 08:23:20 PM »
Basics:


E – Ephedrine
C – Caffeine
A – Aspirin

Ephedra ≠ Ephedrine

Use the 20/200 rule (20mg Ephedrine for every 200mg Caffeine)

Aspirin is optional and if taken should be dosed with baby aspirin (81mg)

As far as I know, there is no scientific reason to cycle ECA.


Ingredient Information:


Ephedrine – Ideally, you want to use Ephedrine HCl. Bronkaid, Primatene, and Ephedrine Sulfate can also be used.
Caffeine – Using 100mg tablets would be useful for the first week or two. Most 200mg tablets can be split easily using fingers or a pill cutter.
Aspirin – Baby aspirin (81mg), but, again, it is not necessary to have great results from this stack.


Scientific Research:


Ephedrine is a sympathomimetic (definition below) drug prescribed as a nasal decongestant, with properties similar to epinephrine. Its effects on both a- and b-adrenergic receptors and its central effects resemble those of amphetamines

    Sympathomimetic: a pharmacologic agent that mimics the effects of stimulation of organs and structures by the sympathetic nervous system. It functions by occupying adrenergic receptor sites and acting as an agonist or by increasing the release of the neurotransmitter norepinephrine at postganglionic nerve endings.

A combination of caffeine and ephedrine has shown to be effective in long-term weight management, likely due to different mechanisms that may operate synergistically, e.g., respectively inhibiting the phosphodiesterase-induced degradation of cAMP and enhancing the sympathetic release of catecholamines.



Quote
This paper describes a 24-week open follow-up trial with reduced obese patients all receiving an ephedrine/caffeine combination (20 mg/200 mg) three times a day. The study was a continuation of a previous 24-week double-blind placebo-controlled study where the ephedrine/caffeine mixture had shown superior weight-reducing properties when compared with either ephedrine alone (20 mg) or caffeine alone (200 mg) three times a day. The medication was stopped between weeks 24-26 in order to evaluate withdrawal symptoms. The follow-up period was from weeks 26 to 50. Of 127 patients included, 99 completed the follow-up treatment, which resulted in an additional weight loss of 1.1 kg (P = 0.02). Adverse drug reactions were all minor and temporary. We conclude that the ephedrine/caffeine combination is safe and effective in long-term treatment in improving and maintaining weight loss. The side-effects are minor and transient and no clinically relevant withdrawal symptoms have been observed.
   ^(http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=0008124407 )^


Quote
The thermogenic effect after E+C (20 mg/200mg) was larger than that of any other combinations, and E and C exerted a supra-additive synergism on thermogenesis and systolic blood pressure, while being without effect on diastolic blood pressure. The combination also had pronounced effects on glucose metabolism by increasing plasma glucose, insulin and C-peptide concentrations. During chronic treatment the effect of E+C on energy expenditure is maintained, while side effects subside because tolerance develops to its hemodynamic and metabolic effects. During dietary energy restriction E+C promotes fat loss and preserves fat-free mass, which may contribute to its chronic effect on energy balance. In conclusion, the hemodynamic and side effects to E+C are transient during chronic treatment, while the effect on energy expenditure persists. The compound also possesses repartitioning properties, which may be useful in the treatment of obesity.
^(http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8384179 )^


Quote
Animal and human studies have suggested a thermogenic synergism between ephedrine (E), a beta-agonist, and caffeine (C), an adenosine antagonist, which may be suitable for the treatment of obesity. To study this phenomenon, the thermogenic effect of single doses of oral placebo, E 10 mg, E 20 mg, C 100 mg, and C 200 mg were compared with the effects of three different combinations of E + C, 10 mg/200 mg, 20 mg/100 mg, and 20 mg/200 mg, measured by indirect calorimetry in six healthy, lean subjects. The thermogenic effect after E + C 20 mg/200 mg was larger than that of any of the other combinations. In this dose ratio, ephedrine and caffeine exerted a supra-additive synergism, whereas the thermogenic effects of the other two combinations were only additive. The 3-hour postintake increase in systolic blood pressure after all three combinations averaged 5 to 7 mm Hg more than placebo (P less than .01), which exceeded the predicted additive effect fivefold to sevenfold. Diastolic blood pressure was not increased by E + C 20 mg/200 mg, whereas the other two combinations increased it by approximately 4 mm Hg more than placebo.
^(http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2000046 )^

Quote
All three beta-adrenoceptor subtypes (beta 1, beta 2 and beta 3) may be involved in ephedrine-induced thermogenesis, but the resistance to complete inhibition by the non-selective antagonist nadolol indicates that at least 40% of the response is mediated by an atypical receptor, which is presumed to be the beta 3-adrenoceptor.
^(http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/0008574280 )^

Ephedrine works by stimulating the release of the body’s own noradrenaline, which stimulates all the adrenergic receptors. The stimulant side effects subside because they are primarily mediated by the beta-1 and beta-2 receptors, which downregulate during chronic use. Thus, the scientists were startled when they found that the thermogenic effect actually increased with chronic use.

The side effects of ECA will diminish after a while, but the thermogenesis will continue on.


Dosing Schedule for 8mg tablets:
(Kaizen, 4Ever Fit)

*Add in 81mg of aspirin per serving if you choose to include it.

Day 1     8mg(E) + 100mg(C)
Day 2-3     8mg(E) + 100mg(C)8mg(E) + 100mg(C)      8mg(E) + 100mg(C)
Day 4-6     16mg(E) + 200mg(C)8mg(E) + 100mg(C)      8mg(E) + 100mg(C)
Day 7-8     16mg(E) + 200mg(C)16mg(E) + 200mg(C)      8mg(E) + 100mg(C)
Day 9-11     16mg(E) + 200mg(C)16mg(E) + 200mg(C)      16mg(E) + 200mg(C)
Day 12-14     24mg(E) + 200mg(C)      24mg(E) + 200mg(C)      16mg(E) + 200mg(C)
Day 15+     24mg(E) + 200mg(C)      24mg(E) + 200mg(C)      24mg(E) + 200mg(C)


Dosing Schedule for 20-25mg tablets:
(Primatene, Bronkaid)

½E = Half the ephedrine dose, e.g. – 12mg

Day 1   ½(E) + 100mg(C)   
Day 2-3   ½(E) + 100mg(C)      ½(E) + 100mg(C)   ½(E) + 100mg(C)
Day 4-7   20-25mg(E) + 200mg(C)       ½(E) + 100mg(C)      ½(E) + 100mg(C)
Day 8-14   20-25mg(E) + 200mg(C)      20-25mg(E) + 200mg(C)      ½(E) + 100mg(C)
Day 15+   20-25mg(E) + 200mg(C)      20-25mg(E) + 200mg(C)   20-25mg(E) + 200mg(C)


Other Directions:

•Try to take the doses 30 minutes before your meal.
•Watch your stimulant intake from other products (PWOs, Soda, Tea, Coffee, etc.)
•You can take it before working out, but 1) take a smaller dose, 2) don’t take a PWO that has stimulants, 3) keep your heart rate lower than normal and that also means no HIIT.
•Taking it twice a day is still effective. This will keep you up at night and sleep is very important, so don’t sacrifice sleep time in order to fit three doses in.
•It’s recommended not to take it if you’re going to be working in the heat. Everyone’s different, but I do manual labor outside and I’ve been slaving away in 90° heat and I’m still here writing this, but I did get lightheaded frequently and I also drank a gallon of water every 5-6 hours of work along with food that is high in electrolytes which brings me to my next point…
•Potassium is important to keep up on this. Don’t take a potassium supplement, just get it from food. You can google foods to find what has good levels of K+
•Don’t be stupid and exceed the dosage (e.g. taking 4 doses/day or taking more than 25mg of ephedrine per serving)
•It’s recommended to take fish oil with this to help with BP. Strive for 2+ grams/day.
•ECA is supposed to work best when on a low-carbohydrate diet.
•Drink plenty of water while using this stack. Thermogenesis means you are going to sweat more and lose more water. Caffeine is a diuretic as well, adding to the water loss.

Side Effects:

•Do not run the ECA cycle if you have heart problems, high blood pressure, are taking SSRIs, SNRIs, MAOI, or other forms of antidepressants, or if you’re pregnant.
Remember to listen to your body and stop if you think anything is wrong.
•You will most likely become addicted to caffeine after this so remember to taper off caffeine to keep the headaches at bay. Ephedrine can be cut cold-turkey.
People have died from ephedrine and caffeine. Don’t be an idiot.
You should be 18+ to consider running this.

Information on the ECY stack:


Yohimbine HCl is added to Ephedrine and Caffeine

Yohimbine ≠ Yohimbe

Personally, I would not recommend doing the ECY stack, but if you are just so inclined to do it, go ahead and google how to run it. It would appear that the E+Y combination can be dangerous for your body. Yohimbine and Caffeine is a much better route to take if you are set on using yohimbine. There is a a bb.com thread about ECY you can google if you’re interested…

An excerpt from that thread: (Not saying this is true because I really don’t know if it is, just thought-provoking)

Quote
NOTE: It is research-documented that alpha-2 adrenoreceptor antagonism initiates a cascade that diminishes beta-adrenoreceptor mediated lipolysis (re: fat burning). Remember, ephedrine is a beta-receptor agonist, so by taking E + Y together, you're basically taking three steps forward and then one step back. Perhaps even more importantly E & Y together = a ton of central norepinephrine relay to the HPTA, which is EXTREMELY bad for you long-term for the following reasons: 1. extremely vasoconstrictive, both in sections of the brain and periperhally, 2. (from 1) there will be a significant elevation in blood pressure, 3. the HPTA (hypothalamus-pituary-thyroid-axis) is basically the 'master control switch' for an innumerable number of the body's metabolic and endocrine processes. Whereas dopamine and serotonin convey to the HPTA that there is positive energy influx, NE/NA (norepinephrine) is a stress-hormone, which is perfectly fine in the short-term for reducing appetite, providing energy while hypocaloric, and causing weight loss. Too-much continual stress-hormone signaling to the HPTA means your body thinks it's starving, seriously. That's why--short term, Y + E work fine. Long-term, they will diminish fat-loss, because they will literally **** over your metabolism from top to bottom. You need to achieve neurotransmitter/catecholamine balance: epinephrine: norepinephrine: dopamine. Taking E + Y together radically tilts the scale in the direction of norepinephrine, which, as I said, will diminish lipolysis long-term and will eventually bring your diet to a screeching halt (unless you are using an exogenous source of dopamine like nicotine to correct this deficiency, and even here, I still do not recommend the pairing based on the other aforementioned reasons). Again, think about it, I'm talking about your HPTA. So that includes a.) thyroid, b.) pituitary (which releases GnRH which, downstream, regulates testosterone levels), c.) hypothalamus (your body's primary 'control panel'). These are not components in your body that should be taking lightly. This is why so many contest dieters are forced to take cytomel, or cannot get their dick hard: because their body is so convinced that they are starving that their HPTA-regulated processes have entirely bottomed out. I sincerely hope everyone can see the significance of this, in terms of the "big picture."





Always remember, there’s no sense in taking weight loss supplements if your diet and exercise routine are not already in check!


If anyone has any other information they'd like to know I'd be glad to research it and add it!



*I'm not sure what the rules are about posting sources for ephedrine so for now I won't post where I purchased mine. If an admin wants to chime in and let me know that would be appreciated.  :P


« Last Edit: June 25, 2012, 01:26:05 PM by IanWatson »
Nitric Oxide Article: http://bit.ly/OJY61b

ECA Info Article: http://bit.ly/Pv3otU

Erase Pro + DAA Log: http://bit.ly/R9VwUs

Jack3d Micro Log: http://bit.ly/McQUGK

First registered SR user ;)



baseFrenzyy
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Posts: 637
Locker Roommates
« Reply #1: June 24, 2012, 09:02:20 PM »
Good job iamwatson. Very informative  ;)

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caleefornyuh
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« Reply #2: June 24, 2012, 11:03:08 PM »
There is a lot of information here. Thanks, I appreciate it, and I'm sure others will as well.
The post is in great detail which is nice as well.

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iSamurai
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Locker Roommates
« Reply #3: June 25, 2012, 06:18:53 AM »
Very nice write up...I've always been curious about the ECA stack.  +rep


stewtron89
Rep: +45
Trust: 58%
Posts: 188
« Reply #4: June 25, 2012, 10:12:38 AM »
Basics:


E – Ephedrine
C – Caffeine
A – Aspirin

Ephedra ≠ Ephedrine

Use the 20/200 rule (20mg Ephedrine for every 200mg Caffeine)

Aspirin is optional and if taken should be dosed with baby aspirin (81mg)

As far as I know, there is no scientific reason to cycle ECA.



Ingredient Information:


Ephedrine – Ideally, you want to use Ephedrine HCl. Bronkaid, Primatene, and Ephedrine Sulfate can also be used.
Caffeine – Using 100mg tablets would be useful for the first week or two. Most 200mg tablets can be split easily using fingers or a pill cutter.
Aspirin – Baby aspirin (81mg), but, again, it is not necessary to have great results from this stack.


Scientific Research:


Ephedrine is a sympathomimetic (definition below) drug prescribed as a nasal decongestant, with properties similar to epinephrine. Its effects on both a- and b-adrenergic receptors and its central effects resemble those of amphetamines

    Sympathomimetic: a pharmacologic agent that mimics the effects of stimulation of organs and structures by the sympathetic nervous system. It functions by occupying adrenergic receptor sites and acting as an agonist or by increasing the release of the neurotransmitter norepinephrine at postganglionic nerve endings.



Quote
This paper describes a 24-week open follow-up trial with reduced obese patients all receiving an ephedrine/caffeine combination (20 mg/200 mg) three times a day. The study was a continuation of a previous 24-week double-blind placebo-controlled study where the ephedrine/caffeine mixture had shown superior weight-reducing properties when compared with either ephedrine alone (20 mg) or caffeine alone (200 mg) three times a day. The medication was stopped between weeks 24-26 in order to evaluate withdrawal symptoms. The follow-up period was from weeks 26 to 50. Of 127 patients included, 99 completed the follow-up treatment, which resulted in an additional weight loss of 1.1 kg (P = 0.02). Adverse drug reactions were all minor and temporary. We conclude that the ephedrine/caffeine combination is safe and effective in long-term treatment in improving and maintaining weight loss. The side-effects are minor and transient and no clinically relevant withdrawal symptoms have been observed.
   ^(http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=0008124407 )^


Quote
The thermogenic effect after E+C (20 mg/200mg) was larger than that of any other combinations, and E and C exerted a supra-additive synergism on thermogenesis and systolic blood pressure, while being without effect on diastolic blood pressure. The combination also had pronounced effects on glucose metabolism by increasing plasma glucose, insulin and C-peptide concentrations. During chronic treatment the effect of E+C on energy expenditure is maintained, while side effects subside because tolerance develops to its hemodynamic and metabolic effects. During dietary energy restriction E+C promotes fat loss and preserves fat-free mass, which may contribute to its chronic effect on energy balance. In conclusion, the hemodynamic and side effects to E+C are transient during chronic treatment, while the effect on energy expenditure persists. The compound also possesses repartitioning properties, which may be useful in the treatment of obesity.
^(http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8384179 )^


Quote
Animal and human studies have suggested a thermogenic synergism between ephedrine (E), a beta-agonist, and caffeine (C), an adenosine antagonist, which may be suitable for the treatment of obesity. To study this phenomenon, the thermogenic effect of single doses of oral placebo, E 10 mg, E 20 mg, C 100 mg, and C 200 mg were compared with the effects of three different combinations of E + C, 10 mg/200 mg, 20 mg/100 mg, and 20 mg/200 mg, measured by indirect calorimetry in six healthy, lean subjects. The thermogenic effect after E + C 20 mg/200 mg was larger than that of any of the other combinations. In this dose ratio, ephedrine and caffeine exerted a supra-additive synergism, whereas the thermogenic effects of the other two combinations were only additive. The 3-hour postintake increase in systolic blood pressure after all three combinations averaged 5 to 7 mm Hg more than placebo (P less than .01), which exceeded the predicted additive effect fivefold to sevenfold. Diastolic blood pressure was not increased by E + C 20 mg/200 mg, whereas the other two combinations increased it by approximately 4 mm Hg more than placebo.
^(http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2000046 )^

Quote
All three beta-adrenoceptor subtypes (beta 1, beta 2 and beta 3) may be involved in ephedrine-induced thermogenesis, but the resistance to complete inhibition by the non-selective antagonist nadolol indicates that at least 40% of the response is mediated by an atypical receptor, which is presumed to be the beta 3-adrenoceptor.
^(http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/0008574280 )^

Ephedrine works by stimulating the release of the body’s own noradrenaline, which stimulates all the adrenergic receptors. The stimulant side effects subside because they are primarily mediated by the beta-1 and beta-2 receptors, which downregulate during chronic use. Thus, the scientists were startled when they found that the thermogenic effect actually increased with chronic use.

The side effects of ECA will diminish after a while, but the thermogenesis will continue on.


Dosing Schedule for 8mg tablets:
(Kaizen, 4Ever Fit)

*Add in 81mg of aspirin per serving if you choose to include it.

Day 1     8mg(E) + 100mg(C)
Day 2-3     8mg(E) + 100mg(C)8mg(E) + 100mg(C)      8mg(E) + 100mg(C)
Day 4-6     16mg(E) + 200mg(C)8mg(E) + 100mg(C)      8mg(E) + 100mg(C)
Day 7-8     16mg(E) + 200mg(C)16mg(E) + 200mg(C)      8mg(E) + 100mg(C)
Day 9-11     16mg(E) + 200mg(C)16mg(E) + 200mg(C)      16mg(E) + 200mg(C)
Day 12-14     24mg(E) + 200mg(C)      24mg(E) + 200mg(C)      16mg(E) + 200mg(C)
Day 15+     24mg(E) + 200mg(C)      24mg(E) + 200mg(C)      24mg(E) + 200mg(C)


Dosing Schedule for 20-25mg tablets:
(Primatene, Bronkaid)

½E = Half the ephedrine dose, e.g. – 12mg

Day 1   ½(E) + 100mg(C)   
Day 2-3   ½(E) + 100mg(C)      ½(E) + 100mg(C)   ½(E) + 100mg(C)
Day 4-7   20-25mg(E) + 200mg(C)       ½(E) + 100mg(C)      ½(E) + 100mg(C)
Day 8-14   20-25mg(E) + 200mg(C)      20-25mg(E) + 200mg(C)      ½(E) + 100mg(C)
Day 15+   20-25mg(E) + 200mg(C)      20-25mg(E) + 200mg(C)   20-25mg(E) + 200mg(C)


Other Directions:

•Try to take the doses 30 minutes before your meal.
•Watch your stimulant intake from other products (PWOs, Soda, Tea, Coffee, etc.)
•You can take it before working out, but 1) take a smaller dose, 2) don’t take a PWO that has stimulants, 3) keep your heart rate lower than normal and that also means no HIIT.
•Taking it twice a day is still effective. This will keep you up at night and sleep is very important, so don’t sacrifice sleep time in order to fit three doses in.
•It’s recommended not to take it if you’re going to be working in the heat. Everyone’s different, but I do manual labor outside and I’ve been slaving away in 90° heat and I’m still here writing this, but I did get lightheaded frequently and I also drank a gallon of water every 5-6 hours of work along with food that is high in electrolytes which brings me to my next point…
•Potassium is important to keep up on this. Don’t take a potassium supplement, just get it from food. You can google foods to find what has good levels of K+
•Don’t be stupid and exceed the dosage (e.g. taking 4 doses/day or taking more than 25mg of ephedrine per serving)
•It’s recommended to take fish oil with this to help with BP. Strive for 2+ grams/day.
•ECA is supposed to work best when on a low-carbohydrate diet.
•Drink plenty of water while using this stack. Thermogenesis means you are going to sweat more and lose more water. Caffeine is a diuretic as well, adding to the water loss.

Side Effects:

•Do not run the ECA cycle if you have heart problems, high blood pressure, are taking SSRIs, SNRIs, MAOI, or other forms of antidepressants, or if you’re pregnant.
Remember to listen to your body and stop if you think anything is wrong.
•You will most likely become addicted to caffeine after this so remember to taper off caffeine to keep the headaches at bay. Ephedrine can be cut cold-turkey.
People have died from ephedrine and caffeine. Don’t be an idiot.
You should be 18+ to consider running this.

Information on the ECY stack:


Yohimbine HCl is added to Ephedrine and Caffeine

Yohimbine ≠ Yohimbe

Personally, I would not recommend doing the ECY stack, but if you are just so inclined to do it, go ahead and google how to run it. It would appear that the E+Y combination can be dangerous for your body. Yohimbine and Caffeine is a much better route to take if you are set on using yohimbine. There is a a bb.com thread about ECY you can google if you’re interested…

An excerpt from that thread: (Not saying this is true because I really don’t know if it is, just thought-provoking)

Quote
NOTE: It is research-documented that alpha-2 adrenoreceptor antagonism initiates a cascade that diminishes beta-adrenoreceptor mediated lipolysis (re: fat burning). Remember, ephedrine is a beta-receptor agonist, so by taking E + Y together, you're basically taking three steps forward and then one step back. Perhaps even more importantly E & Y together = a ton of central norepinephrine relay to the HPTA, which is EXTREMELY bad for you long-term for the following reasons: 1. extremely vasoconstrictive, both in sections of the brain and periperhally, 2. (from 1) there will be a significant elevation in blood pressure, 3. the HPTA (hypothalamus-pituary-thyroid-axis) is basically the 'master control switch' for an innumerable number of the body's metabolic and endocrine processes. Whereas dopamine and serotonin convey to the HPTA that there is positive energy influx, NE/NA (norepinephrine) is a stress-hormone, which is perfectly fine in the short-term for reducing appetite, providing energy while hypocaloric, and causing weight loss. Too-much continual stress-hormone signaling to the HPTA means your body thinks it's starving, seriously. That's why--short term, Y + E work fine. Long-term, they will diminish fat-loss, because they will literally **** over your metabolism from top to bottom. You need to achieve neurotransmitter/catecholamine balance: epinephrine: norepinephrine: dopamine. Taking E + Y together radically tilts the scale in the direction of norepinephrine, which, as I said, will diminish lipolysis long-term and will eventually bring your diet to a screeching halt (unless you are using an exogenous source of dopamine like nicotine to correct this deficiency, and even here, I still do not recommend the pairing based on the other aforementioned reasons). Again, think about it, I'm talking about your HPTA. So that includes a.) thyroid, b.) pituitary (which releases GnRH which, downstream, regulates testosterone levels), c.) hypothalamus (your body's primary 'control panel'). These are not components in your body that should be taking lightly. This is why so many contest dieters are forced to take cytomel, or cannot get their dick hard: because their body is so convinced that they are starving that their HPTA-regulated processes have entirely bottomed out. I sincerely hope everyone can see the significance of this, in terms of the "big picture."





Always remember, there’s no sense in taking weight loss supplements if your diet and exercise routine are not already in check!


If anyone has any other information they'd like to know I'd be glad to research it and add it!



*I'm not sure what the rules are about posting sources for ephedrine so for now I won't post where I purchased mine. If an admin wants to chime in and let me know that would be appreciated.  :P




It should be cycled. Extended exposure to caffeine is damaging to your adrenal gland and endocrine system.


IanWatson
Rep: +162
Trust: 100%
Posts: 408
Locker Roommates
« Reply #5: June 25, 2012, 01:34:29 PM »
It should be cycled. Extended exposure to caffeine is damaging to your adrenal gland and endocrine system.

There's no need to quote the entire original post, first of all. I realize what you're responding to...

Study where a subject took ECA for up to 26 months:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8384187

Studies where subjects took ECA for 24 weeks:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1318281
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8384186

Did you even read the quoted clinical trials?
The first one clearly states "Adverse drug reactions were all minor and temporary. We conclude that the ephedrine/caffeine combination is safe and effective in long-term treatment in improving and maintaining weight loss. The side-effects are minor and transient and no clinically relevant withdrawal symptoms have been observed." That was for a 24 week trial. 168 days of 600mg of caffeine daily.

I think people will be ok.
Nitric Oxide Article: http://bit.ly/OJY61b

ECA Info Article: http://bit.ly/Pv3otU

Erase Pro + DAA Log: http://bit.ly/R9VwUs

Jack3d Micro Log: http://bit.ly/McQUGK

First registered SR user ;)


chase1
Rep: +72
Trust: 75%
Posts: 237
Locker Roommates
« Reply #6: June 26, 2012, 12:48:01 AM »
i spent DAYS finding out all this stuff in bits & pieces getting ready for my ECA run. I wish this was around a few weeks ago ;(

+rep, awesome write up!
chasey's mechabol/stano-200 log--->  supplementreviews.com/forum/index.php?topic=20541.0
before pics on pg 1 . . . afters on pg 3

"abs on a skinny guy are like tits on a fat girl"


Picaboo13
Rep: +97
Trust: 100%
Posts: 533
Locker Roommates
« Reply #7: June 26, 2012, 03:33:26 AM »
I am currently running an ECA stack myself at E12.5/C100/A100. I am only doing it once a day as long as i still feel the effects of it and then will decide to add another but probably only on off days as I have noticed I sleep less or once up can not go bad to sleep. I also work in an aluminum factory and it currently is 95 degrees and up in the building. SO far even on just one dose I am loving it. I am having great lifting days. I may have missed it but I thought that unless you lifted you had a higher chance of losing muscle and fat at the same time?

Also concerning a Y hcl stack, isn't it not recommended for women? I was researching it before and found some sites that said that.
Cause were going the distance, were going for speed-Cake

Escape the WEAKday . . .


IanWatson
Rep: +162
Trust: 100%
Posts: 408
Locker Roommates
« Reply #8: July 09, 2012, 07:24:34 AM »
I am currently running an ECA stack myself at E12.5/C100/A100. I am only doing it once a day as long as i still feel the effects of it and then will decide to add another but probably only on off days as I have noticed I sleep less or once up can not go bad to sleep. I also work in an aluminum factory and it currently is 95 degrees and up in the building. SO far even on just one dose I am loving it. I am having great lifting days. I may have missed it but I thought that unless you lifted you had a higher chance of losing muscle and fat at the same time?

Also concerning a Y hcl stack, isn't it not recommended for women? I was researching it before and found some sites that said that.

Sorry I didn't see this earlier. You should keep lifting throughout a cut cycle to help keep strength and possibly muscle (not 100% scientifically sure that lifting will actually help maintain muscle, but it most likely does) . As far as I know and have seen, Yohimbine HCl should be relatively safe for women, and as I looked around I noticed that it may actually boost sexual arousal! If you have the links to where you saw that it's not recommended for women I'd like to take a peek at those.
Nitric Oxide Article: http://bit.ly/OJY61b

ECA Info Article: http://bit.ly/Pv3otU

Erase Pro + DAA Log: http://bit.ly/R9VwUs

Jack3d Micro Log: http://bit.ly/McQUGK

First registered SR user ;)


Picaboo13
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« Reply #9: July 09, 2012, 10:51:38 AM »
I will look around and see if I can refind those links. I have to say so far I can feel it working but I am not seeing results so I am going to increase the dose and increase the work out but that means increase the food too. I think to keep it easy on my I am just going to go as clean as possible unless traveling. I am also going to keep a food journal to see if I am eating enough as perhaps that is the problem also. I currently work in 100 to so far at the hottest 118 degrees 12 hour night shifts in a factory and that affect appetite also for good and bad. Working on my combination to unlock this, I'll get it.
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nolep
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« Reply #10: July 14, 2012, 01:16:18 PM »
really good info.. thanks you just answer all my questions..

bronkaid still on the market.. you can go to cvs. and ask for it. they going to ask for your id and thats all. you are served.. i just got mine last nite.. and im ready for my first dose.. lets see how it goes..


IanWatson
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« Reply #11: July 15, 2012, 11:18:07 AM »
really good info.. thanks you just answer all my questions..

bronkaid still on the market.. you can go to cvs. and ask for it. they going to ask for your id and thats all. you are served.. i just got mine last nite.. and im ready for my first dose.. lets see how it goes..

Awesome! Unfortunately for me, none of the CVS's or other pharmacies around here carry it. It might differ from place to place I guess  :P
Nitric Oxide Article: http://bit.ly/OJY61b

ECA Info Article: http://bit.ly/Pv3otU

Erase Pro + DAA Log: http://bit.ly/R9VwUs

Jack3d Micro Log: http://bit.ly/McQUGK

First registered SR user ;)


nolep
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« Reply #12: July 16, 2012, 10:52:39 PM »
really good info.. thanks you just answer all my questions..

bronkaid still on the market.. you can go to cvs. and ask for it. they going to ask for your id and thats all. you are served.. i just got mine last nite.. and im ready for my first dose.. lets see how it goes..

Awesome! Unfortunately for me, none of the CVS's or other pharmacies around here carry it. It might differ from place to place I guess  :P

Here CA still able to get it... well tomorrow i will start. lets see in two weeks >> what happen


poshhunny
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« Reply #13: July 19, 2012, 10:58:13 PM »
So absolutely no HIIT while taking ECA? & what about Ephedra from Ma Huang as opposed to the ones u mentioned (Bronkaid, etc)?


IanWatson
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« Reply #14: July 20, 2012, 08:04:51 PM »
Again, Ephedra isn't the same as ephedrine. And I would just play it safe and keep your heart rate away from its max.
Nitric Oxide Article: http://bit.ly/OJY61b

ECA Info Article: http://bit.ly/Pv3otU

Erase Pro + DAA Log: http://bit.ly/R9VwUs

Jack3d Micro Log: http://bit.ly/McQUGK

First registered SR user ;)

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