Topic: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?  (Read 6587 times)

Offline Norris42

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is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« on: October 23, 2009, 01:14:11 AM »
so ive notice that most creatines say that you should take creatine on workout and non workout days...so is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days and if so why?
 

Offline Raptorbh12

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Re: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2009, 04:37:18 AM »
I like to take only one dose on non workout days because it maintains the creatine in your muscles and the next day when you finally workout you have not depleted the creatine stores in your body so your muscular endurance is higher the following workout day.
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Offline garlick

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Re: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2009, 06:51:25 AM »
so ive notice that most creatines say that you should take creatine on workout and non workout days...so is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days and if so why?

Actually it is important, and more important than Raptor makes it seem, and I would implore him to reconsider what he's doing.

The average male body stores approximately 500-700G of Creatine in it's skeletal system. Most of that is stored, and not available for muscle use. It releases approximately 2% of this per day into the blood stream or around 10-14 G per day.

When you supplement Creatine, the idea is to add to the blood stream an additional 5-6 G to overstimulate the muscle, plus add to the stores in the skeletal system, pushing your stores up over the 700G that is usually there. This happens over time, and is why there's a "loading" phase with most Creatine products. Now some absorb better than others, but the idea is you want your blood stream creatine & your stores as high as possible.

Now, the body will filter all Creatine out of it's blood every day or approximately 2% of your total Creatine, so 20-28 G which it replenishes with food every day.

When you're supplementing, it will flush anywhere from 26-34 G because of the "extra" creatine in the blood.

What's funny about the body is that once you start to supplement something, it adjusts and expects that to be there. So if you supplement on Creatine even for 1 week, your body will expect to flush 26-34G no matter what.

If you don't take a serving on an off day, it doesn't matter if you work out or not, it will flush 26-34 G of Creatine and deplete your stores, which will then take more time to increase because your body will over compensate and continue to flush high amounts out.

If I could draw a line graph, it would show that if you miss a day, your line will dip and not fully recover for up to 2 weeks, depending on how good your system is at storing.

If you drop your usage on off days, the same thing happens, though not to as large a degree.

This is all regardless of how your muscles use the Creatine that day.

So in order to stay in optimal Creatine levels of both blood stream & stored Creatine, you need to take the full serving daily, no matter if it's a workout or non-workout day.

Otherwise you will see diminished returns at the end of your cycle.
 

Offline jaycon

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Re: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2009, 07:40:34 AM »
So Garlick, why cycle off creatine for a month if your body flushes the creatine so fast? Would 2 weeks be enough time? I know you don't want your body to get use to a supplement but it seems like it just immediately dumps the creatine from what you have said.
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Offline garlick

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Re: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2009, 07:57:05 AM »
Actually it doesn't flush all that quickly.

Remember, you replenish most of the natural Creatine your body intakes through food, so you lose not 24-36 G, but rather only 4-6 G per day from your stores.

It's actually very slow to raise and lower your Creatine levels, that's why you don't usually see results from Creatine for 3~4 weeks when you start, and then you see results for 6-8 weeks after that. Also why you cycle for 10-12 weeks, because you won't see results for a while.

So lets say you go up by 200-300G of Creatine in your stores, it would take almost the full 4 weeks to drop back down to normal levels, because you're losing 4-6 G per day that way.

Also, as the blood stream levels stay lower, your body filters lower amounts, so the filtration amounts start to slow down.

One more thing, is that all this happens in your kidneys, and Creatine filtering is very toxic, as Creatinine (creatine byproduct) is a pretty nasty substance in the body, so it's very hard on your kidneys and you need to let them return to normal operation before you bombard them again.

 

Offline dammit

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Re: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2009, 09:05:52 AM »
Garlick nailed this all right on the head.  You should try to avoid missing daily intakes of creatine at all costs when you are taking it.  This is especially important in the first couple weeks as this is when your body is adjust the most and will hinder your gains the most.  If you are near the end of your cycle, it is not as bad as you are going to be ending soon anyhow but I would still avoid it.  You specifically want to stay on top of your loading cycle (even though there has been some reviews shown that if you plan on taking it for an extended period of time, "loading" high levels isnt as important as they are if you are on it for shorter cycles because you end up "wasting" more during the loading cycle). 

If you are in the habit of taking creatine 2-3 times a day and miss one of them, I wouldn't worry about it and take the missed doses the next day as this is likely to be wasted but I would avoid missing an entire day all together.  On non-workout days I would take my creatine in the morning after breakfast and be done for the day.  I would just take in a little more than I typically would if I was taking it 2 times a day.
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Offline firasnas

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Re: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« Reply #6 on: October 28, 2009, 10:49:16 PM »
Hey i dont know if this is a stupid q but in concern to what garlik said about it being very hard on the kidneys , is there anything to help the kidneys ? Any supps ? or foods or antyhign at all i can take while on creatine ? Like liverlonger for the liver support any kidny support ? and would it be a good idea ?
 

Offline dammit

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Re: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2009, 06:01:47 AM »
There really are no stupid questions (...within reason ::)) but I don't think you need to worry about your kidneys so much if creatine is your main concern.  Where you get into trouble is if you are taking too much creatine and your kidneys are working to clean the creatinine out of your system.  Alot of supplements have creatine in them or some derivative of creatine such as kre-alkalyn or creatine ethyl ester.  The only time your kidneys may have any issue at all with the toxin level would be during your loading cycle where you are adding more than you really need to try and get your body to adjust and absorb more into your muscle tissue.  After your loading phase, you shouldnt really have to worry about it unless you are taking other supplements with known kidney affects or a family history of kidney problems.  I have never taken any kidney support supplements so couldnt help but Garlick probably knows and may write if he logs on...if not, PM me and I'll find something for you.
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Offline garlick

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Re: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2009, 07:12:21 AM »
Surprisingly, Gatorade.

I know it sounds simple, but electrolytes are what are good for your kidneys as they help with the filtration process. So the more electrolytes you have in your system, the better off your kidneys are.

As Dammit said, you don't have to worry too much if it's just Creatine you're supplementing. Where you do get into trouble, is if you're stacking a lot of compounds with that.

I got myself in trouble because I was taking Creatine with JetFuel which has a ridiculous amount of "other" substances, and then took an advil of all things. Advil & all Ibuprofen substances are EXTREMELY hard on your kidneys. Anti Inflammatories in general should be avoided at all costs if you're taking a Creatine supplement. That can really do damage.

I had to go to the hospital because my kidneys started to shut down, and I was 27 at the time. My kidneys have since recovered and are working fine, but when I was in the hospital the doctor told me to drink Gatorade. So I have 1 G2 a day just to keep the electrolytes in my system.
 

Offline alxcovers

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Re: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« Reply #9 on: October 29, 2009, 12:18:33 PM »
would smart water work as good as gatorade for that?
 

Offline garlick

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Re: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2009, 01:16:07 PM »
Yeah, it's similar enough.

Again, anything with Electrolytes.
 

Offline AnabolicAdam

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Re: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2009, 01:39:38 PM »
NO! It has to be G2 or NOOOTTHHHIIINNG!!!!!!!
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Offline alxcovers

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Re: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« Reply #12 on: October 29, 2009, 03:30:58 PM »
ahahah. does g2 have artificial sweeteners? I usually go old school yellow or the green rain
 

Offline garlick

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Re: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« Reply #13 on: October 29, 2009, 05:03:17 PM »
Yes G2 is artificially sweetened.

I want them to start using Stevia now that it's approved for use by the FDA, we'll see if it catches on though. Definitely healthier than Saccharin or Sucralose.
 

Offline firasnas

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Re: is it really necessary to take creatine on non workout days?
« Reply #14 on: October 30, 2009, 10:52:22 PM »
Thanks all for the tips ;) One more thing what about this stack would it be considered too much ? Superpump 250, sizeon, plasmajet. Should i take somthing out or leave it ? Thanks